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BMW CCA Autocross classifications

Discussion in 'Autocross' started by MrAdventure, Feb 14, 2009.

    • Member

    MrAdventure

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    For those clubs that host autocrosses, how do you classify your cars? Do you go by SCCA Solo-II classifications, or do you do something else? I know some chapters have devised their own classification system. The Boston Chapter, for example, uses its own, based on chassis, engine, and uses a point system on top of that for mods.

    I participate in the NJ BMW CCA Chapter's autocrosses, and we use a variant of the Boston Chapter's rules. For non-BMWs, they're put into an X class, and we rely on the entrants to tell us their SCCA classification, and those results are all PAX'ed together.

    I'd be interested to know how everyone else does it.

    94is guest

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    In the San Diego Chapter, we use a very simple solution.

    4-cylinder stock, 4-cylinder mod, 6,8,12-cylinder stock, 6,8,12-cylinder mod, m-stock, m-mod, mini cooper, and x class. Stock class can run any size wheel/tire, any intake, any cat-back exhaust, aftermarket shock absorbers (obviously not coilovers). R-comps, different springs, tuning, etc, all puts you into "mod". It's not a very complicated system, but we're more geared more towards having fun, versus all of the rules and complexity of SCCA, and its been very popular for 20+ years.
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    mattm

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    FWIW, I am not a fan of the Boston Club's method. I run "R" tires on my 318i, but I end up in the catch-all class of all "R" tire cars: 6 cylinder/8 cylinder, etc. that are prepped and modified way above a "stock" level of performance. It does not make sense to be classed with 330i/M3s and the like. If I were to run street tires then I end up in a very distinct classing schema.

    NYBMWCCA's rules (2008 version), are different than Boston's:
    http://www.nybmwcca.org/downloads/2008-autocross-classification.pdf

    Guess that's why I have NY as my primary region. :D
    • Member

    MrAdventure

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    I hadn't looked at their site in a while. The NJ Chapter doesn't do the same thing with the R Comps - basically they give them a 15 point mod value instead.
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    Jeff Gomon

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    We in the Missouri Valley Chapter run under the SCCA classifications. We don't have a large group, (600 members total) so we just join in with the SCCA events.

    I noticed you have an "x" class....is that for X3 / X5, or 325ix or 528ix, or any of them. I ask because SCCA does not allow SUV / SAV rated vehicles.
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    steven s

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    X class is usually non-BMW.
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    CRKrieger

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    Well, absent a requirement that all cars within a class be mechanically identical (and the attendant requirement for an almost infinite number of classes), you will always have this problem. You have a choice. You can choose your car for the class (but it will be outdated in about 2 years, max) or you can choose the class for your car. I tend to do the latter. If I can win a class, so much better, but I know what I want to drive, autocross classification be damned. I don't take autox too seriously, so this doesn't bother me. I have run under all kinds of classification systems. None is (nor can they be) completely 'fair' to everyone. If you don't like your class, and it matters that much to you, you don't have to run ...
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    mattm

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    CR, et al:
    It doesn't have to be completely fair, I'm used to that.:) But a reasonable breakdown would be nice. The example of NY v Boston's rules, in that NY accomodates the "R" tires. In SCCA's H Stock class I run up against the Mazda3, Honda Civics, and those pesky MINIs.

    Outdated in two years?! Geeze, now you tell me. I shoulda sold the car long ago. Boy, do I feel silly. :rolleyes:

    Matt "Driving an outdated 1996 318i to a National Championship in SCCA's H Stock class in 2002 and a Pro Solo National Championship in H Stock class in 2007. :D" Murray
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    Jeff Gomon

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    Matt,

    Will you be making the trip to my hometown of Lincoln Nebraska for the SCCA National Championships this year? Our chapter is looking at setting up a "hospitality area" for our fellow BMW CCA participants. You will have to let me know if you plan to make the trip.
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    mattm

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    The running joke is that the BMW (or Porsche or insert your favorite dog to kick) Hospitality Tent is right next to the protest garage. :D

    I plan on going. I am hoping the financials will support it. SWMBO says if the money isn't there, we may have to pass this year.

    I know the other BMWCCA folks will appreciate the support. Funny, that never happened in Kansas.
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    CRKrieger

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    Matt,you know as well as I do how cars get to be 'the' car to run in an SCCA class. The 318i is there since the Toyota Paseo got bumped to E Stock after a few years of dominating H. H Stock is the 'everything else' class that runs the greatest chance of an older car suddenly becoming competitive. I ran in H for years ('86 Audi 4KQ). It is a neverending and nearly unfathomable process of politics and lobbying by those with all the 'other' cars.
    • Member

    mattm

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    The Paseo only won in 1992. Not quite dominating. For a few years the Celica did well, then two years of the Civic, my 318i, and then MINIs from '02 to '06, a Mazda3 in '07, and back to the MINI in '08.

    Archival here:
    2005 Karter Bollmann, Friendswood, TX Mini Cooper
    2004 Keith Brown, Des Moines, WA Mini Cooper
    2003 Mark Chiles, Rocky Mount, NC Mini Cooper
    2002 Matthew Murray, Westport, CT BMW 318i
    2001 Gerry Terranova, Allen, TX Honda Civic Si
    2000 Gerry Terranova, Allen, TX Honda Civic Si
    1999 Jeff Cashmore, Glendale, WI Toyota Celica
    1998 Rick McDaniel, Holland, OH Toyota Celica
    1997 Rick McDaniel, Odenton, MD Toyota Celica
    1996 Rick McDaniel, Milwaukie, OR Toyota Celica
    1995 Andy Hollis, Austin, TX Mazda MX-6
    1994 Rick McDaniel, Milwaukie, OR Toyota Celica
    1993 Jeff Reitmeir Sunnyvale, CA BMW 318
    1992 Dan Cadenhead Alpine, CA Toyota Paseo

    1991 Mal Kooiman Zeeland, MI Chev.CosworthVega

    Another counter point of you must have a two year old car is D Stock. Those pesky Integra Type-Rs keep hanging in there.

    I am not sure what years you ran the Audi, but if you look at the above winner's list, there are some very fast drivers (ok, no one showed up in '02 so we know that's an aberration). :D The Audis do have to haul around a lot of mass with the AWD systems,and I'd wager that had more to the car not doing well than anything else. Audis like BMWs are not know for being svelte.

    Realistically, manufacturer support/contingency money drew a lot of good drivers to a class or model, too. Witness the Neons, Mazdas, and MINIs. Not that BMW does pay much or anything anymore. :(
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    CRKrieger

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    IIRC, it was for the one year it was in H. That is often the pattern. SCCA makes a 'mistake' and underclassifies one and it gets bumped rather quickly.

    I was never motivated enough to run on a national level. I did have a local guy in a non-Quattro Coupe who could kick my butt every time (Coupe's ~400 lb lighter than a Quattro and we didn't run in snow :(). I think he finished second at nationals ~1988 or so. Also know Bob Clark (E30 325is), Russ Wiles (E30 325is & M3 championships) and T.C. pretty well. I've met Stacy R. a few times. Kind of surprised I don't already know you personally.
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    mattm

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    I know a few folks that would say you have chosen wisely. :D
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    mattm

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    In 2005, Alan Dahl did run his Audi 90 Quattro in H Stock. He ended up in tenth, two out of the trophies. The mass of the AWD stuff is not quick enough for the MINIs, the Civic and the pesky 318i (I had to get BMW content in here).
    Results for H Stock start on page 27:
    http://www.scca.com/documents/resultfiles/05-nationals.pdf
    Fun to see that first and my fourth place finish was separated by .381 of a second. I do remember "nicking" a pylon with the license plate. Punted various engine shield parts, and the fog light was left dangling. The event chair came over as I was driving back to the pits asking if I wanted the light pushed back into the bumper cover. :D

    BlueAngel M3 guest

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    I have a 98 M3 sedan. (stock). Do I fall in class C for the BMW CCA NY chapter? If I take out my spare will that alter my class? Thanks in advance!

    Nik
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    mattm

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    Nik, if you have absolutely nothing else, then your points would be 48, and solidly in "C Class." Even if you did shocks and a swaybars, you would still be in "C."

    I don't think removing the spare adds any points.

    I am pretty sure I'll be at Nassau tomorrow. Please come by if you see a rusty black 318i. :D

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