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Maintenance Schedule

Discussion in 'Warranty questions' started by captharley, Nov 13, 2010.

    • Member

    Satch SoSoCalifortified

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    About that sludge. . .

    I believe the guys at La Jolla Independent, who have photos similar to these, when they say that the engine was driven by the proverbial old lady---hey, that's pretty much a given in La Jolla, where I am considered a young man by my doctor---and serviced by the book. I surmise that a lot of sludge comes from condensation from an engine that is never fully heated up by short drives to the salon. . . .

    Or, hell, maybe they used roofing tar instead of Castrol synthetic! :D
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    floydarogers

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    Those pics look similar (can't tell - not high enough resolution) to some taken of an engine that the owner took 40K miles between changes.

    Where is your original source for them, and what is the authenticity of the 15K claim?
    • Member

    MGarrison

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    I think you answered your own question, but if you're skeptical of BMW's recommended brake fluid maintenance schedule, go ahead, experiment. You already know the consequences (some braking system component malfunctioning or failing, likely due to rust formation or too much moisture content), you just don't know when. If you're not keeping your vehicles long enough for you to worry about that, then you can schluff off your minimally-maintained vehicle onto the dealer as your trade-in.

    Since BMW has been recommending a 2-year brake-fluid change interval for at least 30 years, perhaps 40 or more, would it not be a common-sense speculation that BMW has experientially found 2 years to be appropriate for maintaining the braking system under average usage conditions?

    If the Bosch Automotive Handbook recommends changing brake fluid every 1 or 2 years, would you not suspect they have substantive reasons for the recommendation?

    Edumacate yerself further if so inclined (the first link is particularly interesting, imo):

    http://www.aa1car.com/library/bfluid.htm
    http://www.zeckhausen.com/bleeding_brakes.htm
    http://www.frozenrotors.com/techtips/2008/12/04/15/
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brake_fluid#Service_and_maintenance

    You appear to be critical of BMW's maintenance recommendations, implying there should be no difference between BMW's and Ford's, mechanically. Is that the case, and if so, why not stick with Fords instead of your BMW's? Is there anything you actually _like_ about your bimmers?

    captharley guest

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    I keep buying BMW's because they are wonderful automobiles. I traded a saleen Mustang for a 330 because it handled better, drove better, etc. just like the commercial says. With regards to brake fluid changes - you agree with BMW that 2 years is ok then why not also accept their oil change schedule as being appropriate? Just a question. Unlike yourself, I am asking questions and am not in this converstaion to agitate or deprecate my fellow auto entusiasts.:p
    • Member

    MGarrison

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    Glad to hear they're meeting your expectations, favorably.

    I think the whole automotive industry, the Society of Automotive Engineers, and BMW are using the same, accepted standard for glycol-based brake-fluid maintenance... so, yeah, I think it is ok!

    My response to your earlier query whither the necessity for 'old-school' maintenance was more an attempt to explain why the old-school-maintenance concept came-to-be, than expressing my own opinion of its necessity. For oil changes, I think what's appropriate depends on whatever an owner or lessee may want, depending on their priorities (I said as much before). If a priority is maximum service life (coupled with a familiarity of automotive maintenance requirements for the long haul), those folks are likely to want oil changed more frequently than their car's computers or BMW suggests. If one accepts what BMW recommends or their car indicates, then obviously that works for them. The difference is BMW hasn't changed the type of brake fluid it's used for ages, or brake-fluid servicing schedules. Switching to synthetic oil with it's extended-service life (comparatively) opened up its own debate - I suppose the unanswered question is, on what science or oil-life/condition studies has BMW based it's oil-change recommendations? Are the current maintenance schedules conservative, or pushing the envelope? And, if they're not conservative.. why? But, I don't think those are anything we'll ever see answered directly, except as time bears out how the cars hold up.

    Is it not a bit presumptuous to assume agitative or deprecative intent? (I posed 5 questions in my reply, btw)... however, I apologize if I came across as a grouch, sorry if I sounded so disapproving and inflammatory - too ez for things to get personal that way. I also have to apologize for being presumptuous, as you don't say in any of your posts how you actually maintain your vehicles, but rather only offered up your own opinions on the matter. Been an interesting discussion, anyway - have you ever used oil-analysis to check your oil's condition at a particular mileage point and assess if it should be changed or not?

    BTW, glad you are able to pursue your automotive interests at this point in your life, with BMW's as part thereof. Thanks also for your service to the country, which should be both honored & respected.

    Now, where's CR... _there's_ somebody that needs agitatin'! :eek::p

    captharley guest

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    Just for the record: My current vehicles:
    M3 oil changes X 5 Total mileage 13000
    530xi (traded) oil changed X 4 Mileage at trade 32,000
    X5 diesel 2800 miles no service to date required
    F150 oil changed every 4500 miles
    Harley Street Glide oil changed every 2500 miles
    Kawasaki Concours 14 oil changed every 2500 miles
    With all my vehicles, most are used for trips and/or at least a 25 mile run. Mileage usually coincides with yearly oil changes and the rest of the fluids are changed based on manufacturer's recommendations.

    When the government decides to tax us to the hilt or the economy goes into hyper-inflation and I have to cut back on my wheels and toys, I really wanted to know what would be the best maintenance schedule that reflected the newest technologies. Maybe BMW will have a "hot" electric vehicle to replace my M3 :D
    • Member

    granthr

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    Well after all that, here you go and change your oil as often as the rest of us loose drain pan nuts! :D :D

    If you want someone to tell you it is okay not to change your oil so often, I think you are asking the wrong crowd. I bet everyone of us currently has oil under our finger nails. :D

    captharley guest

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    You can't change the ways of an old dog. :D My #2 son who is 38 has a brother in law who buys a car and drives it literally into the ground 150000 miles plus and never does a thing - no oil changes, no coolant change - no brake fluid change etc He just traded it for a new vehicle and received a 1K trade in. Obviously, none of us would even consider doing the brother in law non-maintenance schedule, but my point is the car still ran and the kid is still alive and accident free. Surely our cars are as "strong" as the prices of crap that he drove.
    Anyway, I'm done ranting. Thanks for the opinions. Suffice to say the BMW owners might be slightly anal, but in a very good way;);)
    • Member

    Satch SoSoCalifortified

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    Yeah, we do get a little carried away. . .

    Garrison, he say:

    I'm still in shock that anybody used the word "deprecate" around these parts. I don't think you come across as a grouch, Bruddah G, I think we ALL tend to get a bit pedantic and come across as humorless self-appointed authorities on The Way Things Ought To Be.

    That's why I have a sign in my office that says LTFU. It stands, of course, for "Lighten Up." ;)
    • Member

    Scott

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    Not self-appointed in your case, Satch. I hereby appoint you to be my authority on The Way Things Ought To Be. :eek:
    • Member

    Satch SoSoCalifortified

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    Oh my God: Blazey's back!

    You just wanted to show off the graphics on yer M3 Heavyweight. ;)
    • Member

    Scott

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    Actually, I only did it to pad my already massive post count. :rolleyes:
    • Member

    lkchris

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    But in doing so you may be erring on the side of poorer lubrication.

    See for example: http://papers.sae.org/2007-01-4133/

    Perhaps Roundel should track down one of the authors or somebody similar to explain how today's oils are indeed so different.

    This stuff is always couched in terms of "recommendations" and "opinions," but the fact is there is research and data out there.

    captharley guest

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    Received Mike Miller's Old School Maintenance Shedule

    And now I am clear on the Maintenance Schedule. Mike's preamble calmly explains the reasoning behind his schedule and it all makes sense.

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