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Insurance for driving school

Discussion in 'Driving Schools' started by mattlovell, Dec 21, 2010.

    • Member

    mattlovell

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    Since I was aware that some insurance policies basically exclude coverage for anything that occurs on a "racing surface", I thought I would check the details of my policy (through State Farm).

    Exclusion 19 excludes coverage for

    Any covered vehicle while it is (a) being prepared for, used in practice for, or operated in any racing contest, speed contest, jumping contest, or any similar contest; OR (b) on a track designed primarily for racing or high speed driving.

    As writing, the exclusion would seem to cover even a parked car that was hit if it happened to be parked on a track.

    What do people recommend? I assume accidents during driving classes are pretty rare. Is that a correct assumption? Is there driving-school-day or (for the future) autocross-day insurance that serves to cover this exclusion?

    Thanks in advance for any recommendations!
    • Member

    steven s

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    Incidents unfortunately do happen.
    Could be pilot error or mechanical error.
    More often than not, it's pilot error.

    Autocross is a timed competitive event, but I know cars have been covered.

    If you are concerned about insurance, check out http://hpdeins.locktonaffinity.com/

    The other choice is find a car you can afford to walk away from.

    ForcedInduction guest

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    Most but not all auto insurance policies exclude anything track related or competitive in nature. There are a number of companies that write track day driving event insurance coverage for vehicle damage. Ontrackinsurance.com, Lockton Affinity, a BMW CCA endorsed firm and others. The coverage, options, etc. vary considerably so read the fine print. Both event and season options are available based on stated values, etc.

    http://www.ontrackinsurance.com/index.aspx

    http://www.bmwcca.org/forum/showthread.php?t=4709
    • Member

    mattlovell

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    More reading to do...

    Thanks for the replies! Looks like I have some more investigation to do.
    • Member

    ejevo

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    Liberty Mutual covers your HPDE participation

    http://welcome.libertymutual.com/bmw/index.html

    We've had a lot of converts in our chapter to Liberty Mutual due to their very good rates and their coverage of your vehicle when participating in HPDEs. I had GEICO previously, and the Liberty Mutual policy was actually slightly cheaper than my GEICO policy, with the added benefit of being covered on the track w/o any additional insurance purchase. Can't beat it.
    • Member

    Satch SoSoCalifortified

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    Oh?

    I am not so sure that Liberty Mutual covers your car on the track. . . for that, I think you need day coverage from somebody like Lockton Affinity.

    Anybody?

    Ferris?
    • Member

    ejevo

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    Please note I have no affiliation with Liberty Mutual other than being a current customer.

    Our local Liberty Mutual rep made this pitch to our track guys who participate in HPDEs. The definition that was keyed on in the policies is Liberty Mutual (LM) excludes losses for any person "operating a motor vehicle in a race or speed test;", which we were told is not the definition of an HPDE or lapping day. Now, if someone can tell me that this would not hold up in a court of law and that LM would be able to weasel out of covering us on the track, I would certainly like to hear about that. I have heard from at least one Genesee Valley Chapter member that LM did indeed cover an incident they experienced during a DE at Watkins Glen.

    And since I'm sure it's going to come up here, LM does not cover "loss due to or as a consequence of: a. radioactive contamination; b. discharge of any nuclear weapon;" etc., etc.

    You can call Liberty Mutual @ 1-800-526-1547 to inquire about their "BMW Performance Insurance".
    • Member

    mattlovell

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    Talked with Liberty Mutual

    I called Liberty Mutual and spoke with one of their representatives. She stated that they would *not* be able to cover HPDE or driving schools that occur on a track.

    Strangely (to me), one also cannot get a copy of the actual policy prior to purchasing it. I find that quite strange, but she insisted it was standard practice these days.

    It's a shame, because the quote for the policy was coming in cheaper than our current car insurance, and I liked the policy of replacement with BMW OE parts.

    Anyone else have different information?
    • Member

    steven s

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    I would say that is not a standard practice.

    When I moved from MD to SC I asked Nationwide to send me their exclusions before transferring policies. They asked me why? I said, I would just like to read them before I make my decision.

    They sent me a pdf of the exclusions. In SC there is still no wording relating to a surface used for racing which pretty much all insurance companies are adopting.
    Now maybe it was because I was a current Nationwide policy holder, I don't know.
    But I continued with Nationwide. The exclusions still mention, timed, competitive events and preparation for racing. I feel very confident that I am covered. Then again the car I take to the track is not worth that much anymore. I can probably get more money for my diff than the whole car is worth. :(

    I paid a separate premium for OE parts.
    • Member

    ejevo

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    Very interesting - I anticipate some discussion amongst our track group about this.

    ForcedInduction guest

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    There seems to be some odd behavior in the insurance industry in my experience. I too have been told that I could not get a copy of the policy coverage until I purchased it. This seems extremely unlikely and probably in violation of law, but that is what some insurance companies do.

    As far as Liberty Mutual covering DE activities, this may be a grey area that is being "ignored" for those few who have an incident up until now? I expect LM will do as virtually all other insurance companies have done and include an exclusion clause for ALL off-highway activities.
    • Member

    ejevo

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    When I can find the exclusion clause that would be applicable to motorsports ( I believe it uses the term "race" or "racing"), I'll post it up.
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    jmillet

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    My Geico policy written for Washington State has the following exclusion clause:

    "We do not cover bodily injury or property damage caused by an auto driven in or preparing for any racing, speed, or demolition contest or stunting activity of any nature, whether or not prearranged or organized."

    According to our Chapter Risk Management Officer the operative word is "contest". Our HPDS events are instructional in nature with no timing devices allowed and no trophies or prize money awarded hence they are not a contest.
    • Member

    Pyewacket1

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    I highly suspect that anyone attempting to collect a claim under the above clause will still run into stiff resistance, mainly due to the "stunting activity of any nature".

    I'm no lawyer, but there are some on this forum that post often.

    Anyone qualified got a legal opinion on the subject?
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    CRKrieger

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    I do, but it doesn't apply in that state. My qualified NON-legal opinion is that GEICO will do anything they can possibly do to deny coverage for one of our schools. Remember, this is the company that once tried to cancel the policies of radar detector owners and that later gave free radar and laser units to law enforcement agencies [Who then, quite logically, used them to convict folks of speeding, including GEICO customers who then faced rate increases. No underhanded dealing there, huh?] I would RUN, not walk, away from GEICO. In the alternative, I would buy supplemental HPDE insurance so as not to even try to make a claim with GEICO.
    • Member

    ejevo

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    I haven't been able to find the clause in my Liberty Mutual policy which I referred to earlier that excluded racing, even after re-reading it many times over.
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    Satch SoSoCalifortified

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    He's right, you know. . .

    Bruddah Krieger, he say:

    Amen. I have loathed these scrofulous mullets for years. . . Progressive for similar reasons. These days I go out of my way to stomp on every green lizard I see. :eek::eek::eek:
    • Member

    CRKrieger

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    I the only mention I've ever seen of the word 'racing' was a draconian clause that excluded coverage if you were even at a "racing facility". Basically, they wouldn't cover your street car, camper, or whatever if you drove to the track to watch. Morons. :mad:

    Otherwise, look for "competition" or "timed". These are the words that 'CCA escapes with our sometimes-obsessive concentration on education, not racing. If your policy did have a "racing" exclusion, that doesn't preclude coverage for HPDEs because they are most definitely not racing. As organizers, we don't even want you to use the word when talking about them.

    jhall1957 guest

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    Move to "racing friendly" NC! Only state I know of with NO exclusion for anything to do with track, speed, testing, racing etc. Of course, that is only on standard NC personal auto policy.

    And trust me, if you turn in one claim from a track event, another reason will be found to cancel you!
    • Member

    steven s

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    I think it's more based on the company than state.
    But then again, North Carolina is NASCAR country.

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