His shop is faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar away, in Virginia I think. As good as he is, I doubt you'd be willing to trailer your car that far just to get an engine swap. In case you didn't know, automatic cars weren't made for autocross. The computer tells the tranny to shift when you ease up on the throttle in D mode. Put it into manual mode next time; it won't upshift automatically if you're in manual mode and you could control all of your shifts. And hating automatics isn't an exclusive club.
You have to pay more attention man. In the quote i said "even in manual mode" and I was in manual mode the whole time. The car would shift up by itself if you let off the throttle at around 5-6k rpm with the redline being at 6500-6700ish, they should at least let you go on the rev limiter a little! And I wasn't just hating on automatics but new cars/ new car technology in general and how far they are from really connecting the driver with the car and the road. Manual cars weren't made for autocross either
You don't know that I know anything. It is all conjecture and hearsay! That said, if you ever want to have a car built for you, bring the bucks. The answer to how much is usually "if you have to ask..." You would need a complete engine with wiring harness from your donor car along with the ECU and if it has EWS (after Jan 95) then you need a Conforti or similar chip with EWS delete (or the key chip, antenna ring, EWS box, wiring harness, etc from the donor, but the chip is only like $300.) The trans and driveshaft will bolt right up but the angle of the trans will be different and will require tweaking to make it shift porperly. Otherwise use the donor trans and custom mounts and driveshaft. You may or may not need to make small mods to clear the brake booster. You would not necessarily need the E36 radiator and tank, but I would at least use the radiator. It would require a bit of wiring to make it work, but nothing crazy. About a dozen or so wires from the engine harness to the car. I'd be happy to do it for you, but not at my shop. The owner and I do not agree on how to charge for custom work.
He said he wants to buy a BMW. Sure, insurance is more and all that other good stuff, but it's soooo worth it. My bad, I really should have paid attention, but reading the part where it would upshift automatically really threw me off. Does it really upshift in manual when not near the redline? What kind of rubbish is that? As though automatic wasn't boring enough as it was, they had to throw in some nannies to tame the very little possible fun you could have with an auto... Sheesh. Oh yeah? So all that talk about what could be required for a swap from what seems to be off the top of your head is all "conjecture and hearsay"? And the fact that you reply to almost everyone's technical questions and are right most of the time is also "conjecture and hearsay"? Riiiiiiiiiight. This thread, despite it's completely off-topic nature 85% of the time, got me thinking; would I really buy a new car of any other brand or would I rather buy a used BMW? I came up with a list of cars that could be had new that are not BMWs. I excluded anything with a particularly puny and crappy engine and decided to exclude anything that has less power than an E30 318is. ** Note, I am fairly and completely unbiased in excluding all automatics from my list. Automatics are crap... err, they cost more, use more gas, and are not as fun... err, I mean, breed laziness. *** On second thought, just ignore my last statement and consider this: automatics are excluded. From Nissan: * Sentra 2.0S -- 140hp I-4 -- 6-sp. manual (yes, 6-speed!) * Sentra SE-R Spec V (cutting it very close to price range) -- 200hp I-4 -- 6-sp. manual close-ratio * 4-cyl Altimas, but they're not worth having with such a large car From Honda: * Civic Coupe -- 140hp I-4 -- 5-sp. manual * Civic Si Coupe (cutting it very close to price range) -- 197hp I-4 -- 6-sp close-ratio manual (I'm getting bored at this point - these cars are so blah) From Toyota: * Corolla S -- 132hp I-4 -- 5-sp manual * Corolla XRS -- 158hp I-4 -- 5-sp manual From Ford: * Focus Coupe/Sedan -- 140hp -- 5-sp manual From Mazda: * Mazda3 sSport -- 156hp I-4 -- 5-sp manual * MX-5 Miata Sport -- 166hp I-4 -- 5-sp short shift manual From Scion: * Yawn * I'm not even going to include the xB despite its good amount of power because it is so hideous * tC -- 161hp I-4 -- 5sp manual From Mini: * Cooper S (cutting it close to price) -- 172hp I-4 -- 6sp manual Of the non-BMW's, I personally would have the MX-5 Miata, hands down. Now, let's compare to what you could buy used if you bought a BMW for the same price (up to $20k for comparison's sake): 2003 E46 330i Sport Package with 37k miles - $19,995 -- 225hp I-6 -- 6-sp manual 2001 E46 330i with 66k miles - $15,999 if you were tighter on cash, get this -- 225hp I-6 -- 6-sp manual (I think 6-sp?) You want a deal? 2001 Tower of Power 540i w/ 67,500 mi. - $15,600 -- 282hp V-8 -- 6-sp manual Seriously, the user Bimmer is better value. They've got tons more options, they're more comfortable, handle much better than most of the cars listed there (maybe for the exception of the Mini and the Miata), and ultimately, are cheaper to initially buy. The downside is the maintenance, but that's what that leftover ~$7k is for.
Our 2002 Toyota Avalon handles better than new Corollas. Actually when I think about it so does my friend's 97 Camry. The newer Corollas are way too understeer prone (and come on FWD???) You might be able to find a used S2000 in the 20k range instead of a Civic. Sentra is a good choice. And yes, the Miata does destroy the competition on that list, such an amazing car for a relatively low price and they're as reliable as it gets for the performance they put out. Good list overall! What I'd add, though it is a little older, is a 510 2-door though you can even get a WRX easily in the 20k range (they do have understeer though) What's the price range on MazdaSpeed 3's?? And why are we even bothering thinking about things that aren't BMW's ?? When you're driving German engineering everything else on the road might as well be a box
I don't really have anything to add, I just wanted to outquote Arash, make the looongest post in the thread, and make everyone scrollllllll and scrolllllllll and scrollllllll!
You actually quoted everything? LOL. Moosehead, thanks for the answer. If I do this, it would be like over a year from now. Like I said before, I'm dreaming of a S50/S52 right now. Now here is my question to you. Doing the conversion at your driveway would probably take some time (Saturday into Sunday). Is $1500 english or language that you don't understand...LOL. Would that be a fair price or is more needed? Everyone, I am speaking for Botond. He is only joking about getting a non-BMW vehicle, aren't ya! However, if you do get a non-BMW vehicle, than I'll avoid you like the plague
If you already had everything you needed, that is about 20 hours shop time, or several weekends personal time. 20 hours shop time usually covers a drop in engine swap, so you see how that can be an issue going to someone at a shop. It could take longer than the roughly 40 hours personal time that might buy you (plus, you gotta buy the food and beer.) Unfortunately, you never have everything you need, so don't count on it being quick or easy. Really, though, the toughest thing I can think of with that swap is the motor mounts, since that will require welding. The wiring is a piece of cake, since I already know the pinouts and wire colors. Now a straight drop in, that is easy. Helped someone I worked with pull off a S50 into E34 wagon swap in 12 hours (straight) while I was working on other cars. Then did the S52 swap into that in 8 hours when he found out that his S50 burned oil (broken #1 piston when he got the used motor.)
Botond correct me if I am wrong, but your point here is why would anyone drop $20K on an only slightly better than average car when you can spend less and get an awesome BMW! E36 M3 anyone? GR
Food and beer. Hmmmm, you'll be drinking all the beer since I don't drink . Lets see, so an average shop might charge me about $3200 for the whole job of 40 hours @ $80 labor rate. WOW! Plus getting the donor car. Total cost for the project would be roughly $8K! Now does putting a regular M50 engine in a E28 worth it? 189-190 HP in an E28 body seems to be decent as well. I did see a M50 non VANOS for sale on Roundel for like $800 w/ full service records. Still, I would need to the get manual trans. Good thing I'm a good dreamer! How about an Isetta for the OP with a S54?
I KNOW what the OP said. I stand by what I said: an 18 year old should buy a Honda Civic Si. The 2.0-liter, dual-overhead camshaft K20Z3 engine produces 197 horsepower at 7800 rpm and 139 lb-ft of torque at 6100 rpm. Thanks to special Honda-developed performance technologies, such as the ultra-precise Drive-by-Wire™ throttle system, 3-rocker i-VTEC® variable valve timing, a cold-air intake and high-flow, low-heat exhaust manifold, the K20Z3 engine boasts an impressive flat torque curve from idle all the way to its race car-like 8000-rpm redline. Plus, the K20Z3's intake and exhaust system is quieter and less obtrusive when cruising at highway speed, but produces an aggressive, sporty sound at full throttle. * 197-hp, 2.0-Liter K20Z3 engine * 21 city/29 highway mpg* * Close-ratio 6-speed transmission * Helical limited-slip differential
Entirely correct. I dunno 'bout you, but I'd rather buy an E36 M3 for the price of a new Civic Si. But then again, everyone has different priorities, and fun just happens to be mine.
Not if he buys an M that's exactly the same price as a new Civic Si. For that price, that M better be absolutely mint with nothing wrong with it!
Well the OP did say that he wants to drive a BMW. The E53 is too big for him. I think he wants an M car. E46 M3 can get him lots of girls on campus . However, most 18 yr old's will want to speed. Ok, maybe every 18 year old who gets a hold of a E46 M3 will let er rip!
